MARY LOUISE KELLY, HOST:
Ghislaine Maxwell was once the girlfriend of Jeffrey Epstein. She was also widely seen as his right-hand man. Maxwell was convicted of sex trafficking, among other charges, back in 2021. She is currently serving a 20-year sentence in prison. During her trial, Epstein's victims testified that Maxwell helped facilitate girls for Epstein to sexually abuse. Now, with Epstein back dominating the news cycle once again, the Justice Department wants to question Maxwell, stating, quote, "If Ghislaine Maxwell has information about anyone who has committed crimes against victims, the FBI and the DOJ will hear what she has to say," end quote.
So what might prosecutors learn from her, and what might she have to gain? Mitchell Epner is a former assistant U.S. attorney for the District of New Jersey, where he handled cases involving sex trafficking. He joins me now. Mitchell Epner, what do you make of this latest twist? - the Justice Department wanting to question Maxwell.
MITCHELL EPNER: So this is extraordinarily unusual. It's unusual that the DOJ would publicly announce that they are speaking to a potential cooperator, and it is extraordinarily unusual that somebody as senior as the deputy attorney general would be the person conducting those conversations. In over 30 years as a criminal defense attorney and my time as a federal prosecutor, I've never seen anything like this.
KELLY: So very unusual. What might officials learn from her? What might they be hoping they would learn from her?
EPNER: Well, I don't know what they're hoping they might learn from her because what - the only time that she's ever spoken about these topics under oath was a deposition that she gave in the civil suit brought by Virginia Giuffre, who's since passed away.
KELLY: Right.
EPNER: And in that deposition, she basically said she knew nothing about anything involving Epstein and underaged girls and sexual massages or anything of the sort.
KELLY: So, OK, basically, you're telling me that we don't have any evidence that she would have relevant information that she, A, has not shared up to now, and, B, would be shilling (ph) - willing to share now?
EPNER: Well, if she says something now that confirms what she was convicted of, then she would be contradicting her prior sworn testimony, and that makes somebody an extraordinarily bad witness.
KELLY: So let's flip it around and consider what she might be angling for here or what she might have to gain. Ghislaine Maxwell is currently appealing her conviction. Is there a scenario under which prosecutors could offer her - I don't know - some kind of deal as incentive to reveal whatever she may know?
EPNER: So the incentive would have to come from the White House, not from prosecutors in all likelihood, because it's been more than a year since her sentence was imposed. And that basically takes away the discretion of the courts to reduce the sentence except under extraordinarily limited circumstances, which I don't think apply here.
KELLY: OK, so this is a case of - that only the White House could issue a commutation, a pardon. If you were her attorney, would you be looking to leverage that?
EPNER: If I were her attorney, I would be looking for a way to get my client out of jail because unless something changes, she's likely to have to serve a sentence longer than the rest of her life. So it is in her attorney's absolute interest to try to get her a deal to get her out of jail.
KELLY: So understanding you're not her lawyer, but from your experience working these type of cases, what do you think is actually going on here? Is this a true legal move or more of a political move, given all of the political circus swirling around Jeffrey Epstein?
EPNER: I have never seen a case like this before. This does not strike me as something that prosecutors would be doing in the ordinary course of events. It seems highly likely to me that this is entirely directed out of the White House and not something that the Department of Justice is doing on its own.
KELLY: Although, I will just note that when asked about this today, President Trump said, look, I don't know anything about this request to talk to her. I - that is a witch hunt, the continuation of a witch hunt, and he looked to change the subject.
EPNER: I have nothing to say to that (laughter).
KELLY: We will leave it there. That's former assistant attorney for the District of New Jersey Mitchell Epner. Thank you very much.
EPNER: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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